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Offline johnnyapplepie  
#1 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 7:05:29 AM(UTC)
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I've had a few friends ask me about using Rye instead of corn. I don't know much about rye. Has anyone made a wash using rye? If so what were your ingredients and how'd it turn out?
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#2 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 9:03:27 AM(UTC)
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Dang..thought nobody would ever axe..lol. I am down to the last of a my five pound bag of rye flakes from Admin. Best price in town as in five bucks and change for five lbs. The wicked miscreants at the family owned home brew shoppe was trying to skin me out of three bucks a pound for the self same stuff. Anyway..its nearly empty now. For a 5-6 gallon wash seems like a cup along with 2.5 lbs yellow CM gives a real nice flavor. I jump up to 3 cups on a double sized wash. I aint good at math ya know? I think its highest purpose at my house is as corn meal kicker in other words. Makes it last a bit longer too. Not much use to combine it with SF or maybe something else like it which already has a killer good flavor on its own. With SF the Rye gets lost in the shuffle..as least to my well edumacated pallete..lol. Not sure at current prices a person could afford to use it alone as in a mash type scenario unless somebody wanted to give out some free. Now a nice fella did send me some links to Ebay and somwhere else to buy it in big bag. Whole berries..flakes etc. Seems like the berries was pricer than the flakes for some reason. Prob where Admin gets it..lol. Fella could snag enough to make do like that I would think. Do you recall the movie Oh Yeah Yeah posted before he went silent? Its prob still in the data base somewhere. Anyway it showed a boutique distillery using Rye Flour and Enzymes to make Rye Whiskey. No sugar involved at least that they fessed up about. I guess a person could just follow that recipe it they needed to make Rye Whiskey. Not sue what other criteria could make it qualify.
Offline Bushy  
#3 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 12:33:06 PM(UTC)
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Malted grains are what is used to make whiskey and Scotch and also AG beers. Without the grains being malted and then mashed properly during the cooking the starches will not be converted to the sugars needed for good fermentation.
Although some people here still seem to think that throwing unmalted grain in with a bunch of sugar is making whiskey, the truth is all that is being made is flavored ethanol.

Have Fun!
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#4 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 1:58:40 PM(UTC)
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Ok the grain got to malted. Enzymes dont work. Gotcha thanks. Sure hope the enzyme salesman do not pop in here and happen to read all this stuff. I dont think he knows about all these exotic factoids as to why his stuff no worky as advertised. lol
Offline Bushy  
#5 Posted : Sunday, October 14, 2012 5:52:41 PM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: bigwheel Go to Quoted Post
Ok the grain got to malted. Enzymes dont work. Gotcha thanks. Sure hope the enzyme salesman do not pop in here and happen to read all this stuff. I dont think he knows about all these exotic factoids as to why his stuff no worky as advertised. lol


I never said anything about enzymes. I'm pretty sure you have heard about Single Malt Scotch, they are'nt talking about something from the soda shop.
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#6 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 2:18:48 AM(UTC)
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Ok..now I got it. Will not look for hooch at the soda shoppe. I can remember that part. Thanks.
Offline johnnyapplepie  
#7 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 7:54:38 AM(UTC)
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Is it possible to do generation runs with malted rye or is only good for one fermentation?
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#8 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 9:08:45 AM(UTC)
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Well once it gets malted it turn into a sugar I think...so hopefully once its used there shouldnt be much left to propagate. This the generational deal is more of a hobby with sugar shine boys or should be maybe. Now you might get a second opinyawn here..lol. There is a lot about science Mr. Wizard did not cover..lol.
Offline heeler  
#9 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 9:57:46 AM(UTC)
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"
Originally Posted by: johnnyapplepie Go to Quoted Post
Is it possible to do generation runs with malted rye or is only good for one fermentation?


Well if your using grains I bet you could coax a little more flavor out of em but if your using a LME then I think ones gonna be the limit. With the LME your gonna dump the whole fermenter into the boiler but with grains you leave em behind ----- see what I'm getting at here???? Most malted rye grain are pretty faint but if you tried cooking them again (i know cooking will de-nature the enzymes) you might get alittle more from them. Of course you'll have to use a enzyme additive and more sugar but that wont change the flavor of your llikker so givera go and let us know what happens. Good luck.Cool"
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#10 Posted : Monday, October 15, 2012 11:11:27 AM(UTC)
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Good point on the non assertive nature of Rye. Sure notice in the flake version too. At least when used in chintzy amounts by broke folks. Sippin some smooth White Dawg which contains the aforesaid substance as we speak. It tastes mighty special...but not much like Rye Bread. Maybe I was expecting the wrong flavor nuances..lol. Hey think the CM WG combo is gonna be a winner. Highly unusual ferment. Still got about 3" of Guiness Stout looking beer foam floating on top. Whats up with that? Has lost some of its nutty smell..and stronger in the alchyhol. It just keeps up a real undulating rhythm of fermenting sorta like watching a Lava lamp. Did you ever figger out if a person could use Whole Wheat Flour instead of Wheat Germ? Trick to try it would be to locate some un-degerminated (sic) four I would guess. What do you think? Anybody?
Offline shovelhead91701  
#11 Posted : Thursday, November 15, 2012 3:38:18 AM(UTC)
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Why not buy rye at a local feed/seed store and malt it yourself? Has no one tried this yet? I have a commercial greenhouse and I see no problem with sprouting a bunch of rye seed and then smoking it to stop growth. Why would this not work? Especially when we are talking about a small amount for our purposes. I plan to try it on one of my first runs after my cleaning runs. I plan to proceed with the following plan: 1. sprout rye seed 2. smoke rye seed 3. rub out rye seed to get rid of the hulls and chaff. 4.Ferment rye seeds with water and 6 row malt. 5. distill batch 6. enjoy? If anyone more experienced with this process sees a problem please say so to avoid me wasting a lot of time and effort!
Offline Crabby Krausen  
#12 Posted : Thursday, November 15, 2012 3:47:45 AM(UTC)
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I believe that rye is not used for feed but i dont know for sure-- If it is seed rye it will have a anti fungus chemical in it. Thats all i think i know.
I just did some looking around because i thought i remembered something.
If my research is correct rye whiskey is corn mashed with rye. Again i dont really know.
Offline johnnyapplepie  
#13 Posted : Thursday, November 15, 2012 9:15:35 AM(UTC)
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shovelhead, let us know how it all turns out. I've still yet not made a rye run but I plan to very soon like maybe next month.
Offline Mkjt88  
#14 Posted : Thursday, November 15, 2012 4:00:15 PM(UTC)
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"
Originally Posted by: shovelhead91701 Go to Quoted Post
Why not buy rye at a local feed/seed store and malt it yourself? Has no one tried this yet? I have a commercial greenhouse and I see no problem with sprouting a bunch of rye seed and then smoking it to stop growth. Why would this not work? Especially when we are talking about a small amount for our purposes. I plan to try it on one of my first runs after my cleaning runs. I plan to proceed with the following plan: 1. sprout rye seed 2. smoke rye seed 3. rub out rye seed to get rid of the hulls and chaff. 4.Ferment rye seeds with water and 6 row malt. 5. distill batch 6. enjoy? If anyone more experienced with this process sees a problem please say so to avoid me wasting a lot of time and effort!


There are plenty of youtube videos out there showing this process. Seems very easy. I honestly don't have the drive to do it myself but a bit of research and you should get it. I have never used rye grains but used rye malt extract. Was some pretty good stuff. Let us know how it turns out."
Offline ohyeahyeah  
#15 Posted : Friday, November 16, 2012 5:54:52 AM(UTC)
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Originally Posted by: shovelhead91701 Go to Quoted Post
I plan to proceed with the following plan: 1. sprout rye seed 2. smoke rye seed 3. rub out rye seed to get rid of the hulls and chaff. 4.Ferment rye seeds with water and 6 row malt. 5. distill batch 6. enjoy? If anyone more experienced with this process sees a problem please say so to avoid me wasting a lot of time and effort!



Step 4 should actually be cook rye and mash it. Since you are going to the trouble of malting your rye why would you bother with malted barley? You could just use regular rye and cook it then add the malted barley for the mash. Or having gone through the trouble of malting the rye just use straight rye, either all malted or a combination of straight rye and malted rye.
You can also buy malted rye. Its sold for making beer and whisky.
Offline shovelhead91701  
#16 Posted : Friday, November 16, 2012 6:35:37 AM(UTC)
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"
Originally Posted by: ohyeahyeah Go to Quoted Post
Step 4 should actually be cook rye and mash it. Since you are going to the trouble of malting your rye why would you bother with malted barley? You could just use regular rye and cook it then add the malted barley for the mash. Or having gone through the trouble of malting the rye just use straight rye, either all malted or a combination of straight rye and malted rye.
You can also buy malted rye. Its sold for making beer and whisky.


right about the cook.... I forgot to say it that way instead of jumping to the ferment stage. I was thinking about the flavor of rye being kind of bitter. I thought adding the barley might mellow the profile overall. I am a complete novice though that is why I posted it for feedback like yours. So as far as flavor changes do you think the barley would mellow the bitterness of the rye?"
Offline ohyeahyeah  
#17 Posted : Friday, November 16, 2012 11:40:26 AM(UTC)
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My all grains have always followed a bourbon grain bill so i can't give any advice on how a little barely might flavour a mostly rye grain bill. I think it comes down to personal preference. I have tried all rye whiskys like Lot 40(pot stilled small batch) and don't find them to be bitter at all. For me my least favorite whiskies are single malts so malted barley is the last grain i would be looking at using, though i do use it in my bourbon mashes.
It is worth noting that a lot of blended whiskies are blended from pure grain whiskies and neutrals. A little bit of all rye, a little bit of single malt blended with some neutral spirit. These can be quite tastey(to my taste).

My plan once i get the refluxer done is to continue with the bourbon bill but also add an all rye whisky and vodka and then blend the three to make a "Canadian Whisky". The nice thing about this hobby is there are no limits and no rules.

If you want to a rye with some malted barely for flavour go for it. My only point was the malted barely will convert your rye starch just fine in your mash so if that is your plan there is no real need to go to all the trouble of making your own malt rye.
Offline Bushy  
#18 Posted : Friday, November 16, 2012 12:47:00 PM(UTC)
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+1 ohyeahyeah ---- way to much work malting your own grain. Good to know how in case the economy collapses but other than that I buy my malted grains.
Offline shovelhead91701  
#19 Posted : Monday, November 19, 2012 9:51:32 AM(UTC)
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=ohyeahyeah;20690]If you want to a rye with some malted barely for flavour go for it. My only point was the malted barely will convert your rye starch just fine in your mash so if that is your plan there is no real need to go to all the trouble of making your own malt rye.


I agree with you on that point, I am just retarded about knowing how to do things and sprouting seeds is one thing I am very good at...lol I was going to go about it from the standpoint of knowledge gained instead of looking at a work/cost basis.
I also build lots of other things in my life that would be a lot cheaper and easier to buy instead. I watch way too much History and Science channel at night! WinkBigGrinCool[
Offline cayenneboy  
#20 Posted : Tuesday, April 08, 2014 2:13:26 PM(UTC)
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Does anyone have a good Rye whiskey recipe? Im trying to figure out a good ratio of ingredients. I was thinking 51% Rye, and 49% wheat/corn/barley.
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